PLUME: It’s amazing to hear from a perspective that I have no clue about - of actually discovering those things firsthand, as opposed to this pop culture mentality of being introduced to things or sold things.

SPINER: Yep. It was all new. Summer variety shows, that were replacement shows - people they’d never give a series to. The Keith Brasselle Show was a big favorite of mine.

PLUME: The summer shows were the equivalent of, “Can you stand in front of a camera and not freak out”…

SPINER: Yeah, really. Exactly.

PLUME: When you’re talking about being 6, 7 years old - were you starting to gravitate towards an idea that you even liked performing, or was it merely as a spectator and performing wasn’t even …

SPINER: You know, I’m not sure that all kids aren’t performers. Everybody plays cowboys and Indians - it just depends on how seriously you play it.

PLUME: And how quickly - if ever - you transition out of that playacting mentality.

SPINER: Right, exactly. In my case, never - it just continued.

PLUME: Was is something that your mother encouraged?

SPINER: She didn’t encourage or discourage it. It was, like, inevitable. My biggest influence as a child, there was no question of this in terms of entertainment, was Jerry Lewis. And I think that’s true of every kid my age - and when I say kid, I mean looking back. But most of the guys I know now, who are my age, the first real god of entertainment for them was Jerry.

PLUME: Was it because, at that time, he looked so incredibly young that he was identifiable?

SPINER: That could be it. And because what he did was really funny to kids. I’m not so sure how funny it was to adults… I mean, when he was with Dean, certainly - in clubs and stuff - it was funny to adults. Where the films were concerned, he was a big kid, and a I guess that was the deal that we related to.

SPINER: No - although I loved Milton Berle, and The Texaco Show was a big deal. Jerry was what I went to the movies to see … I did a movie earlier this year called Master of Disguise…

PLUME: The Dana Carvey pic, right?

SPINER: Yeah, and it was pretty much critically lambasted, you know. But I had a feeling while I was doing it that we were doing something not that far off from what Jerry did back then. It had the same kind of appeal. I know that anyone I know who has kids and went to see it, told me that the kids just loved it. I felt Dana was kind of doing what Jerry had been doing back then, for me.

PLUME: That sort of slap-stick…

SPINER: Right, just like that sort of crazy, nutty humor that only kids could really, really get.

PLUME: It didn’t depend on an English Lit class …

SPINER: Or even ersatz sophistication of any sort, which we all have gravitated towards.

PLUME: So it was more instinctual.

SPINER: Absolutely. It was just like he was just kind of reaching out and trying to grab a kid’s funny bone - and that’s all that he was after. And I think he achieved it.

PLUME: I think it’s one of those movies that will probably hold up as one the kids will play over and over again, ad infinitum.

SPINER: I think so, too. I felt really good about being in it, for that reason. He was really clear about who he was making a movie for. He has kids, and he said, “I just want to make a movie for my kids, that I think they’ll think is funny,” and I think that’s what I did.

PLUME: I think too few people make that choice today, and too few studios allow that choice.

SPINER: They do, yeah. I read a couple of reviews that actually compared it to Jerry or Peter Sellers, and said, “They never made this bad a movie.” But I beg to differ.

PLUME: Did they see Fu Manchu?

SPINER: Yeah, correct. Or The Bobo, you know? Both Sellers and Jerry are geniuses, certainly, but they did make really bad movies as far as adults were concerned.

PLUME: And it’s also that rose-colored glasses homogenizing effect, when you look back.

SPINER: Exactly. I really think the critics have forgotten what appealed to them as a child. They think they remember, but they don’t.

PLUME: You tend to think to much, as an adult…

SPINER: Yeah, I think so, too.

PLUME: It’s like, “Well, here’s the rationalization filter, and what the hell is he doing?”

SPINER: Yeah, exactly. Right. A couple of them would say, “Even kids six years old wouldn’t enjoy this movie.” Well, how do they know?

PLUME: Well, I know a good friend of mine took his kid to see it at one of the press screenings. He said, “There were parts of it that I laughed at, and parts where I said ‘What the hell’s going on’ … but my son seemed to love it.”

SPINER: Yeah, because kids don’t ask that - it’s just an image that cracks them up.

PLUME: A gut reaction.

SPINER: Totally! And that’s what Jerry did for me as a kid. I used to throw myself down the stairs at my house, just hoping for the same response that Jerry got from me.

PLUME: Something tells me that your mom wouldn’t react quite the same to throwing yourself…

SPINER: You know what, believe it or not, she did - which was really encouraging.

PLUME: Is it something that was a personal desire - performing - or was it something where you just tended to gravitate towards things like school plays? I know that you got into it in high school…

SPINER: Yeah, it wasn’t until high school that I got into at a serious level.

PLUME: Because, outside the home, it really wasn’t something that was available?

SPINER: Well it was, but I didn’t …

PLUME: Avail yourself of it?

SPINER: No. I was a real kid. I was doing Little League baseball and, you know, definitely class clown - and that was enough for me. Community Theater wasn’t of any interest to me. But when I got into high school, I had an incredible teacher who sort of inspired everybody who came into contact with him.

PLUME: This would be Cecil Pickett?

SPINER: Correct.

PLUME: Who inspired quite a few people, it seems.

SPINER: Yeah, exactly.

PLUME: What was it about his style that drew you in and facilitated that?

SPINER: There were a couple of things. I think what drew us in, initially - all of us - was that the drama room was the only air conditioned room in the school. So everyone wanted to take drama, and everyone did - everyone took drama. But if you could get into 6th period drama, which was like the real deal, that’s when it got serious. I fortunately got it early enough that I had a nice, long tenure there - cool tenure, I should add.

PLUME: Good way to finish out the day.

SPINER: Exactly. But then once we got there, we realized how serious he was about it, and he took it very seriously. He really gave us a sense, I think - a taste - that was just amazing.

PLUME: Was it playfully serious? Was there a sense of play still involved?

SPINER: Oh yeah. But we were scared of him. I mean, we were as scared of him as we were of the gym coaches. You know, but we idolized him also, because he was a giant.

PLUME: Was it fear of his criticism?

SPINER: Or his disapproval. He wanted us to take it really seriously, because he felt like if we were going to go into a professional situation, he wanted us to be disciplined and knowledgeable. He really took his job as an educator very seriously.

PLUME: What would be his standard reaction, if someone wasn’t taking it seriously?

SPINER: He could really just bore holes through you, just saying nothing, but he had these piercing, black eyes. He was part Indian, from Oklahoma, and he just had this stare that could just destroy you.

PLUME: You said you were the class clown…

SPINER: Not in his class. I didn’t need to be, in his class, because I was performing in his class.

PLUME: Not even towards the beginning? What was the shakedown period for you?

SPINER: Really, not even in the beginning. We had assignments, and I think I scored on my assignments enough that he invited me into the advanced class.

PLUME: And from then on, I’m assuming it was just such an intense atmosphere that it swept you along…

SPINER: Well, it did, and you know what, I still - this is crazy - but when we opened a play… we did three plays a year or something like that, two straight plays and a musical, and when we opened the musicals on a Friday night to the school, we did two weekends, I think… but the first night, still - I’ve been in Broadway shows, and I’ve never been in an opening as exciting as those nights.

PLUME: Just because it was new?

SPINER: Well, partially because it was new, and secondly it’s because we always knew we had something good, and that people were going to be knocked out by it. The ensemble I was working with, you know - the Quaid brothers (Randy and Dennis), and Tommy Schlamme, and Cindy Pickett, and Trey Wilson - just amazing actors.

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